Front locker, when to use it?

[LagunaH1]

Works like a charm in an H1.

X2. I can't think of a situation I couldn't BTM my way out of

 

[skeptic]

I rarely use the front locker, typically on steep loose hill climbs or ledges and similar. I occasionally will engage it getting through some rough rock/boulder type areas, but in that situation I go easy on the throttle. IMHO, after wheeling an H3 w/rear locker and an H3T with lockers front and rear: 1) rear locker plus traction control does a pretty good job and will get you through most things. 2) Front locker is better.

I don't know about all this BTM stuff on an H3, what I always did was stay off the brake, give it a little throttle, then wait and give the traction control a chance to kick in. It took a bit of getting used to, it's not instant, but if you stay off the brakes and give it a chance it does work.

 

[LagunaH1]

what I always did was stay off the brake, give it a little throttle, then wait and give the traction control a chance to kick in. It took a bit of getting used to, it's not instant, but if you stay off the brakes and give it a chance it does work.

That's how it always worked for me and once I got used to the delay before TC kicked in, it worked really quite well

 

[silvrzuki77]

Just saw this post. You have the right idea as others have pointed out. Keep the wheels as straight as possible, slow and controlled and you will be fine. With my kids in the truck and towing the Teardrop if it looks like a crappy climb I will lock it. Now on my old rock buggy with upgraded axle that front locker made the difference.

 

[06 H3]

It's funny, when I was talking to someone about lockers they thought rear was better for steep hill climbs and I thought the opposite...the rear end has most of the weight on it, that has plenty of traction and the front lacks the traction when comparing it to the rear.

H1s are badass....I hope to own one someday. I already know what kind I want. I love being on the trail with them as they walk up an obstacle and the Jeeper watching goes damn! Does he have lockers? I tell them no...they don't understand what BTMing does lol

 

[Mb30sdl]

I only BTM going uphill, like 2N17x ledge to keep front wheels from spinning too fast, grubbing traction and snapping front half shaft. I had that happen on snow run in BB, I was spinning ~40 mph stuck in snow and front wheel finally reached the ground and granaded right half shaft.

 

[Zach]

This whole thing has been quite amusing. Could shoot holes in some responses, but I won't. Might be some fun, but too much drama. I've got a front locker. Blew a a half shaft on John Bull. Lil wheel spin. But when the tire hit the ground BOOM. Learned from it. Rarely ever ever engage it. Have used it twice since then. Moab Rim on a ledge I was hung up bad. Neo told me to engage it. First question was, am I planted on all four. Got me up and disengaged it. 2's seems it always the right side. Only reason I locked the front was the gear change. Had it not been for that. I wouldn't have

 

[06 H3]

People keep telling me having front and rear lockers is a world of difference compared to just one or none. The problem for us is that we are scared to use it. It will be trial and error....but if I break a halfshaft atleast the fuse theory worked.

 

[Big2dabank]

I'm not scared to use my front locker at all, the half shafts on the 2 or so easy to change, less than 10 mins total and you don't even have to remove the front wheel. So if I bust one, a quick change and I'm good to go, $57 core charge at autozone and I have my spare shaft back. I know that is not the same for the 3's and the shafts are a little more difficult to change. I'm not going to lie to you guys, for the type of wheeling I do, loose sandy clayey crap and slick limestone, it makes a night and day difference. However with the kids in the rig most of the time, even if I know I can climb it without the locker, if it will make that climb super easy to not risk sliding and bouncing around the kids unnecessarily, you dam'n right I'll use it. But like Zach said, it was an easy choice when I was regearing to go ahead and add the locker, if it wasn't for that, I probably would not have one.

 

[3Hummers]

Zach now that you mention it all of the blown H2 front half shafts I have seen on front locked H2s have been on the passenger side. Curious.

 

[cbetts]

For us people with manual transmissions, lockers are a necessity. I don't think I will ever add a front locker though. I may not be able to BTM very well, but my traction control always seems to do the job as long as I am patient and give it a chance to work.

 

[4speedfunk]

BTM is an "open diff" technique. It causes the spiders gears to alternate from right-to-left dominance, and it works on any open-diffed rig, (done it many times with open-diffed Jeeps). It honestly doesn't do much by itself. But on the H3...the puter will step-in and work with BTM to take full advantage of moving around the power to the wheel that needs it. The puter needs to sense wheels spinning at different speeds to do anything. BTM simply uses the brakes to fake the puter into searching for traction at one of the corners. Without using the brakes...the system still works in the same way. The only difference is that you have to apply more throttle and induce wheelspin for the puter to sense it. And as we all know...that's not healthy for your H3. So BTM is a way to induce traction control at a relatively low speed, without mashing the throttle and spinning the hell out of the wheels. Simply put...it allows you to crawl slowly and still use the TCS, something that is unique and special about late model TC-equipped rigs.

Last week I wheeled with several groups, and I saw completely different techniques between old school "gun & go" rigs....and late model IFS/TCS rigs. FJ-cruisers, Xterras, and Hummers make very difficult obstacles look easy (and downright boring to the spectator), and its all due to the electronic systems and proper BTM technique. There will always be a place in my heart for a 6000 rpm assault up a rutted-out ravine but, seeing bone stock IFS rigs tackle the same terrain at 3 mph is equally amazing...just in a different way.

 

[alrock]

Whatever the opinions are on whether a 3 can take advantage of BTM , I will offer my results.

On an obstacle like Hell's Gate, I could not control wheelspin with only TC and a rear locker as my tires slid off the line. Once I used brakes in conjunction with the accelerator I was able to easily modulate my throttle, maintain wheelspin and climb the obstacle.

I did not have as much success with this technique before I had the rear locker

 

[skeptic]

BTM is an "open diff" technique. It causes the spiders gears to alternate from right-to-left dominance, and it works on any open-diffed rig, (done it many times with open-diffed Jeeps). It honestly doesn't do much by itself. But on the H3...the puter will step-in and work with BTM to take full advantage of moving around the power to the wheel that needs it. The puter needs to sense wheels spinning at different speeds to do anything. BTM simply uses the brakes to fake the puter into searching for traction at one of the corners. Without using the brakes...the system still works in the same way. The only difference is that you have to apply more throttle and induce wheelspin for the puter to sense it. And as we all know...that's not healthy for your H3. So BTM is a way to induce traction control at a relatively low speed, without mashing the throttle and spinning the hell out of the wheels. Simply put...it allows you to crawl slowly and still use the TCS, something that is unique and special about late model TC-equipped rigs.

I don't think you are giving TCS the credit it deserves. You don't have to mash the throttle and spin the hell out of the wheels to get it to kick in. It works just fine with a nice easy barely spinning wheel. I will say it's not constant, in my experience it kicks in for a couple seconds getting all tires turning at roughly the same rate then lets off. This could be why some people find BTM better, brakes always on gives some power to the non-spinning wheel(s) regardless of TCS. In my old open diff Cherokee days BTM was my only option, and it can help.

To be honest, I don't really know how BTM affects the computer controlled of stuff. For all I know, pressing the brakes with a spinning wheel might cause the brakes on the non-spinning wheels to pulse due to anti-lock brakes thinking the non/slow turning wheels are locked up while trying to stop.

 

[RamRod]

Man there are so many factors to think about on here.

The only easy answer looks like its combination of personal preference and situational conditions!

I have had the puter kick in on hills that I forgot to lock the trans or axles for and get me up nice and slow, very cool... kind spooky! (all those little elfs controlling the throttle and brakes!!!)

 

[4speedfunk]

I don't think you are giving TCS the credit it deserves.

Quite the contrary. The TCS is what makes the H3. My favorite technique is to hold the motor at 1800 rpm or so, and let the elves figure out the best way to get me where I point it. Having the Dana up front gives me more confidence to explore the TCS much further than I ever felt comfortable with the stock front end. Wheelspin is not the pin on the grenade anymore.

 

[MaxPF]

I will give my locker experience, albeit not with an H. I've wheeled some pretty gnarly stuff with lockers. Keep in mind, this is a 10b front axle on 37's, so not a setup with the best record of survival. And yet, I never broke anything.

When I got lockers, I first did the usual "try the obstacle unlocked", and if that failed, "try rear locker only", and finally if that failed, F&R lockers. What I found was that I beat on the truck a lot more unlocked or with rear lockers only. With both lockers I could crawl gently up an obstacle that would otherwise require skinny pedal to overcome. Wheelspin and binding are the two conditions that usually lead to carnage. I avoided lines where binding would occur, and I eliminated wheelspin by using BOTH lockers. I eventually got into the habit of throwing on both lockers for any obstacle UNLESS a lot of steering was required, in which case it was rear locker only.

 

[Mb30sdl]

There will always be a place in my heart for a 6000 rpm assault up a rutted-out ravine.

:thumbs::ha:

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

last weekend, we were out practicing SAR stuff, I in my Alpha Adventure, another guy in his 12 JK rubicon. He had a locker in the front, I do not - we both made it up the same stretches.
That said, in snow, having all 4 wheels spinning at the same rate at the same time is a huge advantage.

 

[Hans3T]

Steep climbs that could not be tackled in 4low.

Sent with Tapacrack

 

[backcountryislife]

You don't have to mash the throttle and spin the hell out of the wheels to get it to kick in. It works just fine with a nice easy barely spinning wheel.

I'd have to agree, being a manual where BTM isn't an option really (can be done, but very difficult on a big feature), I learned quickly that it was just a matter of patience. IF the wheel was in the air, just slowly give it throttle, letting the wheel spin slowly, but consistently and TC would kick in, and slow that wheel down, then if I kept a constant throttle it would look like I had lockers till the wheel hit the ground. Funny, the TC on the Jeep isn't as effective as it is on the H3, both running same tire, both manuals... H3 was 4.56, JK is 5.13. I assumed it was the difference in computers as not much else is different.

 

[Portager]

I use my front locker sparingly. but there are times that it makes very difficult climbs much easier. I don't worry about getting a wheel in the air as long as I don't let it spin. Spinning is what causes breakage.

Where the front locker helps the most is on those steep inclines where vehicles have created holes in a diagonal pattern so that you only have two wheels on the ground most of the time. Without a front locker you need momentum, but with the front locker you can crawl right up. Here is an example of Cbetts at Hauser geode beds.

 

[cbetts]

I use my front locker sparingly. but there are times that it makes very difficult climbs much easier. I don't worry about getting a wheel in the air as long as I don't let it spin. Spinning is what causes breakage.

Where the front locker helps the most is on those steep inclines where vehicles have created holes in a diagonal pattern so that you only have two wheels on the ground most of the time. Without a front locker you need momentum, but with the front locker you can crawl right up. Here is an example of Cbetts at Hauser geode beds.

I have learned a lot since that day and believe I could have made that had I waited for the T/C to kick in. I went back through some video footage from one of the LCC runs and noticed that my locker was not working at all, yet I had taken obstacles that I thought I needed my locker to get through. It was actually Alex that showed me a lot when he ran Cleghorn/2N17X with us. His ability to take Powerline Hill was quite impressive.

 

[Portager]

I followed Alex up powerline hill. I was impressed he could do it without a locker. I did it with both lockers and made it look easy. I think the lockers allow you to use less skinny pedal which is easier on the vehicle.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

[Highatop]

This is some good stuff...:corn: